CFITrainer.Net Podcast

The IAAI and CFITrainer.Net present these podcasts with a focus on issues relating to fire investigation. With expertise from around the world, the International Association of Arson Investigators produces these podcasts to bring more information and electronic media to fire investigators looking for training, education and general information about fire investigation. Topics include recent technologies, issues in the news, training opportunities, changes in laws and standards and any other topic that might be of interest to a fire investigator or industry professional affected by fire. Information is presented using a combination of original stories and interviews with scientists, leaders in fire investigation from the fire service and the law enforcement community.

Rod Ammon: Welcome to the CFITrainer.net Podcast. Today we're spotlighting the health and safety of all personnel who work at post fire scenes. We're talking about important new research from UL's Fire Safety Research Institute about hazards in the post fire environment. It's challenging assumptions many fire investigators have, and may change how you protect yourself during an investigation.

With us are Dr. Gavin Horn and Jeff Pauley.

Dr. Horn is a research engineer with UL's Fire Safety Research Institute. Prior to joining FSRI, Dr. Horn was the director of research programs at the Illinois Fire Service Institute. He's also served as a firefighter, apparatus engineer, and fire investigator with the Savoy Fire Department. He holds a PhD in mechanical engineering from the University of Illinois, and an ME in fire protection engineering from the University of Maryland. Dr. Horn has published over 90 peer reviewed journal manuscripts and given numerous presentations at meetings and conferences around the world.

Rod Ammon: Jeff Pauley is a corporate post fire scene health and safety consultant, a fire investigator with the EFI Global Incorporated, and the former fire marshal for Bedford County, Virginia. He is the IAAI Health and Safety Committee Chairman, and represents the IAAI on the oversight and planning board of the firefighter cancer cohort studies, fire investigation expansion study. He also serves on the technical advisory panels for the ULFSRI's post fire environment research project, and the Fire Protection Research Foundation and North Carolina University research project, looking at the effectiveness of fire investigator clothing ensembles, and decontamination wipes. He is an IAAI CFI, and IAAI CI, as well as a member of the Institute of Fire Engineers. Gentlemen, welcome to the podcast.

Dr. Gavin Horn: Thank you for having us.

Jeff Pauley: Thank you very much for having us.

Rod Ammon: All right. So let's start by setting some context. Dr. Horn, What are the main chemical exposure issues fire investigators and other professionals who work in the post environment deal with?

Dr. Gavin Horn: Well, there's a number of different exposure challenges that the fire service has, and in particular the post fire investigators. We typically look at things in two different groups. Exposures to particulate that may be in the air after the fire, as well as vapor and gas phase contamination that we find in the air. Particularly it is often made up of largely carbonaceous materials, but there's other vapors and compounds that may absorb to those contaminants. And when we think about things in the vapor phase or the gas phase, oftentimes we are concerned about volatile organic compounds, or VOCs, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, or PAHs, aldehydes, one of the most common examples are formaldehydes. But there's a number of other compounds that may be present in the environment. This is one of the challenges that we have when trying to protect our post scene investigators because of the large number of compounds, that we don't know necessarily what will be there, what magnitudes will be there, and what is the best way to protect from those individual contaminants.

Rod Ammon: And many of the times, or I would guess most of the times, these things you speak of are invisible.

Dr. Gavin Horn: That's correct. In most cases, we will not be able to see many of the contaminants that are present on the fire ground. When high concentrations of particularly, larger particulate particulate, are present on the far ground, we may be able to see those, particularly if there's a light or sun coming in through the structure itself. However many of the vapors themselves will not be visible by the naked eye, nor will some of those smaller particulate. Some of this particulate can be less one micron in size, and those are not detectable by the naked eye.

Rod Ammon: Yeah, I bring it up because just as you said, I've heard people say, "Well, when I shine my flashlight in a dark room, if nothing's floating around I'm feeling pretty good." And that's a scary thought.

Dr. Gavin Horn: That is.

Rod Ammon: Jeff, what are some of the factors that affect the exposures that fire investigators have in the post fire environment?

Jeff Pauley: Well, as, as Gavin, very nicely brought up, the majority of these hazards are not visible. The thing that fire investigators need to understand is that the fact that they can't see them doesn't mean that they're not there. And there's so many folks that believe that a cold scene, which is generally defined as starting somewhere around 72 hours after the fire's been extinguished with no visible, of course, we understand the caveat there, or detectable hazards, they think that a cold scene is a safe scene and no PPE respiratory protection is needed. And unfortunately that's just not true, and the science is now starting to show that. And so our goal is really to get folks educated and understanding that these hazards are there. The other challenge with it is that, barring an acute issue, injury, illness, whatever, the hazard that these particulates, gases and vapors, present may not manifest for years, and based on individual susceptibility may not manifest at all. So it's really challenging to get folks to understand the hazards and the protections that are needed for them.

Rod Ammon: Yeah. Well, I think in a lot of cases, compared to what we see on TV, it's a much more physical job than a lot of people consider. Can you talk about digging and all things that people are doing and how that makes it even worse?

Jeff Pauley: Right. So the first challenge is that the average firefighter working at a structural fire is in the hot zone, in the hazardous environment, for maybe 10, 15, 20 minutes. On rare occasions, they may go out rehab, get a second SCBA bottle and go back and do more, but significant exposure but short period of time. The average fire investigator is in the post fire scene on average about three hours. They are at many more fires than the average firefighter. And unfortunately, and this is what we're all trying to change, is less well protected.

So when they're in there, and even if they're just walking through, they're stirring up the little particulates, the nano particulates, as Gavin mentioned one micron, two, three microns, can't see these things. When you dig out a fire scene, what we affectionately refer to as a good fire scene, right? Where the debris is a foot or more deep, whatever. Not only are you stirring up vast amounts of this particulate matter, but one of the still unknowns is how much gas molecules, vapors are trapped down in that debris. So when they start to dig it up, all of this stuff is being released. And it just screams for effective PPE, and we have many folks who are not doing that.

Rod Ammon: Yeah, it was interesting to me, you said that somebody would go in and change their SCBA. And I don't know, I remember it where we were just trying to get people to put any kind of mask on. What would you like them to have?

Jeff Pauley: Well, the minimum that we recommend is a P 100 particulate filter combined with a canister that covers for oily vapors, acid gases, and formaldehyde. Significant measures in many post fires of formaldehyde, and especially in the two hour to going forward timeframe. But the study that UL very nicely did and was recently published looked at the post-fire environment and showed reasonably significant amounts of formaldehyde well after the fire was extinguished. And so good respiratory protection. Now there are some fire investigation agencies that are wearing SCBA all the way. And if you can, that's wonderful. But that solution does not work for everybody.

Rod Ammon: Dr. Horn, you had something to add?

Dr. Gavin Horn: Yeah. If I can. I think Jeff addressed many of the points I wanted to make, but the highest level of protection-

Jeff Pauley: Sorry about that.

Dr. Gavin Horn: Oh, no, no. It was perfect. As Jeff mentioned, the highest level of protection that we can provide from respiratory perspective is through the SCBA. And that is going to provide the best protection from the particulate, as well as the gases that we had just discussed on the fire ground. One of the important considerations that we also have to have around the fire ground, and particularly some of the longer term post fire investigation activities, and the shoveling that you mentioned earlier, is the physical exertion that's required in doing those activities. So as we more further protect our firefighters from the chemical contamination that's in the fire ground, which is something that we need to do to reduce those exposure risks, we also have to understand that that can change some of the risks for heat stress, because we have an individual that's more heavily and more fully encapsulated because now if they're wearing an SCBA carrying some additional weight. There can be breathing resistance changes with any type of breathing protection, airway protection that we might use.

It's also true that these things affect the ability to operate some of the tools. Digging the fire ground with an SCBA on your back and the shoulder straps, that changes the biomechanics of how you move. So we need to understand that, while we want to protect firefighters as much as possible from these particulate and these vapors, there's other impacts that that can have and other injury risks that we need to take care of and ensure that firefighters have the proper work rest cycles, ensure our fire investigators also have those proper work and rest cycles, ensure that our fire investigators are properly hydrated as they go to the scene and then while they're working on the scene for multiple hours. We need to make sure that we help them to stay hydrated so that they can continue to wear as much PPE as possible. And while it's also important to make sure that our fire investigators are medically and physically capable of doing those jobs. So all of this really wraps up a larger holistic discussion about risks in the fire service and for post fire investigators.

Rod Ammon: You brought up an interesting point, but I wanted to follow up with Jeff first. Jeff, I hadn't thought about it, and maybe it's ignorance, about the fact that fire investigators go to a lot more fires. And I wonder if fire investigators think about that. But I think it's an excellent point. I just thought it should be brought up again, because I think sometimes they just feel-

Jeff Pauley: So look at most any jurisdiction, and I'll pick on my local municipal fire department in Greensboro, North Carolina. They've got about 40 engine companies throughout the city. So they go to a structure fire. The average residential structure fire, you may have three engine companies there. That may be the only fire that they work for that shift, but there's only one fire investigator on duty. So that investigator may be going on some nights, because they work a 24-hour shift, they may be going from fire to fire, to fire, to fire. Are there resources that they can call in to get more help? Of course, which you have to do for the more involved investigations.

But it's not unusual at all for that to happen in any jurisdiction. And that is the rule rather than the exception within the fire investigation community on the public side. On the private side things are not a lot different. It's not uncommon to do two a day. It's not uncommon to do one a day for five or six days, depending on a variety of factors. And so the exposure quantity is higher, and the exposure length of time you're in the environment is higher than the average firefighter.

Rod Ammon: Yeah. I just thought it was a good point that you had brought up, and I thought it was a good reminder to our fire investigators out there and hopefully a motivation to take more of this seriously every day. One thing that we haven't talked about quickly, and it just came to mind, we're thinking about all this breathing. But what about absorption through the body?

Jeff Pauley: Absolutely. Absolutely. And to continue with Gavin's point on exertion, as the body heats up, as the skin surface heats up, it absorbs more readily the contaminants. There's an old publication out that said, and a lot of places have picked up on this and repeated it, that for every five degrees increase of skin surface temperature, the absorption goes up something like 400%. Well after doing a lot of digging, one of our graduate research folks at NC State University found out that whoever it was that originally wrote that had recanted that statement because the numbers could not be substantiated. But the concept is very valid, and it has been shown. So we get hot, we get sweaty, the skin temperature goes up. If your skin is not covered, it's not protected, it's getting the particulates and the gases on it, most often that you can't see, but they're there. And the rate of dermal absorption is greatly increased.

Rod Ammon: So what have you seen as not necessarily the best protection, but what have you seen as... Well the best would be nice, right? But what have you seen as a good standard when you've seen fire investigators out there and they're doing things to protect themselves? What are they doing properly? Jeff Pauley: Well, the bottom line of that is covering the skin surface, whether it is long pants and a long sleeve shirt, or it's Tyvek, or it's a non-structural yet firefighter coveralls, things like that. There are a variety of things. Now what's nice is our friends again at NC State are doing a research project on this very subject that's currently underway. So they're testing multiple different apparel options and exposing them to the gases in particulars found in the post-hire environment.

Jeff Pauley: So we will know when that study's over, and it just started less than a year ago and it's a two year study. So we'll know more, but the bottom line is any covering is better than nothing. So we'll see where that goes, but there are public agencies that are wearing structural, which is fine, but as Gavin pointed out, you can easily overexert and can and get hot and sweaty and nasty, and the work rest cycle has to be looked at. Tyvek is good, but it's not a whole lot better from that standpoint. It's kind of like wrapping yourself in plastic wrap, right? Bottom line at this point is any covering is better than nothing.

Rod Ammon: Okay. Again when we think back to what we've seen over the years, a lot of this requires more thought, more motivation of the fire investigators that are out there and prioritizing their lives. So I don't know. I always like to keep moving back to: What are the very tactical things that we can do?

Dr. Gavin Horn: First of all, if we take a step back and look at it from a higher level perspective, in terms of how contaminants can make their way into the fire investigator's body, there's three main routes of entry that we are typically concerned about in terms of fire ground contaminants: Their inhalation, absorption, and ingestion. And each of those, we discussed a little bit about SCBA and other respiratory protection. SCBA can largely eliminate the respiratory route, and it's very effective. Some other respiratory protection techniques are not quite as effective, but can do a very good job for the contaminants that we see in the post fire scene. The absorption route is one that is becoming under much more close scrutiny during the fire fight, as well as during the post fire scene investigation, because if the respiratory route is protected, then that is believed to be now one of the most important routes for contaminants to enter the firefighter's body.

And as Jeff had mentioned, the rate at which contaminants enter the body is not completely understood at this point, and it's likely to vary based on a whole lot of different things, including what the compound is itself and things such as skin temperature, body temperature, and other things along those lines. So there's a lot more research that has to be done in order to understand how these contaminants make it into the body, but there are things that we can do to reduce the risk and opportunity for them to enter the body. Wearing PPE is one of the most straightforward ways, particularly in covering as much skin as you possibly can. Though again, research is trying to understand a trade off between covering skin, reducing that dermal absorption and heat stress, because the way the body cools itself is by the sweat evaporating from the skin and then cooling down the body itself. So there's a trade off that has to be understood there.

The other thing that we're starting to understand in terms of contamination on the body is where it's coming from. Is it coming from the activity itself? Or is it coming from the doffing process of the gear itself? So as we take off any gear that might be contaminated, it's possible to transfer some of that back to the body during the doffing process itself. So being careful to take off your personal protective equipment, and in particular, the gloves that you wear gloves happen to be one of the most contaminated pieces of PPE that we find on the fire ground. So taking those off with care, not to touch the outside of that gear that's contaminated, is a way that we can reduce the risk for some of those exposures on the fire ground itself.

And then of course, the next step is to remove it from the skin as quickly as possible. So wipes that can be used on scene can reduce some of that exposure as quickly as possible on the fire ground. Even after each time maybe the gear is doffed, or each time there's entry that's being when someone comes back out and swaps out the air bottle or grabs a drink of water, they can start to do some of these hygiene practices on the fire ground. But also we want to encourage firefighters and fire investigators to get a shower and more thorough clean as rapidly as possible once they have completed at work on the fire ground itself. So there's a lot of ways we can help to address some of those concerns for dermal absorption, and there's a lot more to be learned as research continues.

Rod Ammon: Well, we appreciate that research. It always seems to pay off. Dr. Horn, getting onto more research, what's FSRI's research agenda as it relates to these health and safety hazards in the post fire environment?

Dr. Gavin Horn: Well, the research agenda is focusing on what we can do to help fire investigators to have a healthy and safe occupation, and doing the job as effectively as they possibly can throughout their time on the fire ground as a fire investigator, and also hopefully having a long and healthy retirement. So we're looking at what we can do to help fire investigators to be more effective and efficient in the work that they do. So Dan Madrzykowski is leading a number of projects looking at identifying different fire patterns, how to collect that information, to use that information more effectively. We're looking at some of the health and safety concerns around the fire investigators, and particularly here, the post fire investigator exposure to chemical content. But there's a lot of additional work that we need to understand. As we change some of the PPE, how does that impact the balance between chemical exposure protection and some of the heat stress that we've talked about?

So we're trying to look at this from multiple different perspectives in terms of the efficiency and effectiveness of the data collection that's being conducted on the fire ground, and also some other work looking at how that can be used in the laboratory and models that are developed often to help the fire investigators. So that's kind of the effectiveness and efficiency side. And on the health and safety side, right now we're really focusing on that chemical exposure aspect, but eventually we'll have to look at that from a more holistic reduction of injuries on the fire ground for the post fire scene investigators that takes into account chemical exposures, thermal exposures, change to biomechanics and other things that may increase risk for the fire investigator.

Rod Ammon: So your most recent study, though, is in airborne contamination during post fire investigations. I understand hot, warm, cold scenes. Can you summarize the testing procedure used and what are your conclusions so far?

Dr. Gavin Horn: Sure thing. Yeah. So in January of 2022, we were fortunate to have a paper published in the Journal of Occupational Environmental Hygiene that was focused on airborne contamination during the post fire investigations. And as you mentioned, looking at a range of the different scenes or the timeframe after the fire has been suppressed, which include the hot and the warm and then the cold scene. The study was actually conducted alongside a separate study that was focused on firefighter tactics. So a study funded by the Department of Homeland Security through their fire prevention and safety grants looked at firefighter size up search and rescue. As part of the study, we built a pair of 1600 square foot, full-size residential homes, single-family homes built as they typically would in today's construction that have the same type of residential furniture that you might have in a house in the 21st century.

And in those homes, we developed 18 different fires. Half of them were ignited in a bedroom, and another half were in a common room. So the common room included the kitchen as well as kind of a great room setup, where there were couches and chairs, tables, televisions, and those sorts of things. So kind of an open floor plan structure. And these fires were initially developed in order to look at how firefighters might respond differently based on how they might put water on the fire in a different manner, or how they might open up windows and doors and affect different rescues from within those structures. We were fortunate to be able to take a look at those once they were suppressed and to measure the contaminants in the environment. And some of them during the overhaul process itself, immediately after suppression was conducted, we moved some of the tools in to measure airborne contaminants, particularly vapors and gases in the air, volatile organic compounds, aldehydes and things like that during the overhaul process, which is also what investigators might move into what's called a hot scene A.

So immediately after the suppression, holding some of the overhaul in order to be able to document some of the scene before additional overhaul. We then also held it for an hour after overhaul had been completed for what is often referred to as a hot scene B scenario, where we went in and did the investigation, took some pictures, identified patterns, moved some of the material around as is necessary to look at where there might be different patterns underneath any material that might have fallen down from the ceiling, from the cabinets, from the bedroom materials themselves. And then in a few cases, we boarded the structure up. We said, "All right, we're going to close this up, put OSB over the door and any of the windows that have failed, and come back a day later," which is common occurrence on the investigations.

And sometimes might have to come back three days later, or up to five days later. So in each case we would come back, do an hour's worth of investigation, and that included all sorts of different types of activities, taking pictures, drawing diagrams, shoveling out the scene. In some cases, some drywall came down off of the wall, or some of it was removed, particularly in the last day in order to inspect structural components. And those things were done again up to five days out from the fire scene itself.

So that's a quick overview of the study. I know that was a whole lot in a short period of time. But the main outcomes that we found from here, just if I can put a bow on this, the two main things that we identified were that, first of all, they're elevated. And in some cases, hazardous levels of airborne particulate that are going to be encountered during any phase of the post fire scene investigation. And it really depended on the activities of the fire investigator. It wasn't in every scenario, but even up to five days out, depending on what the fire investigator was doing, we saw some elevated, and again, oftentimes hazardous levels of that particular contamination.

The other thing that we found was the formaldehyde concentrations exceeded some recommended exposure limits, even out beyond the initial fire attack, even beyond hot scene A and hot scene B. We actually found that after the scene was closed up that formaldehyde concentrations increased that one day post the fire and exceeded some of the short term exposure limits or NIOSH ceiling limits for formaldehyde. And they remained elevated even above recommended exposure limits out to three days post fire. So we often think about volatile organic compounds, such as benzene, or semi volatile PAHs, such as naphthalene as some of the compounds we're most concerned about during the fire fight, or at least in the highest concentrations. But during the investigation phase, we actually found that formaldehyde was higher than we had expected and relatively higher than some of those exposure limits that are recommended for occupations. So that's the main takeaways that we had from that study.

Rod Ammon: Well, it sounds extensive, and it's always great news just to hear the amount of detail. And, and I love the redundancy of the two matching homes and looking at the different scenarios and the great room, the bedroom. It really captures, I think, a lot of what fire investigators are walking into every day. So, Jeff, how does it feel? I mean, you've been fighting this fight for a while.

Jeff Pauley: Let me tag onto what Gavin just said, and also to answer your question. This was the first scientific study of the true post fire environment. Typically fire scene research stops when the big red trucks leave the scene. In the past, we've had to extrapolate fire scene research, fire overhaul research, and make some assumptions about the post fire environment. The research that UL just did is, that I'm aware of, the first true post fire scene research. And Gavin very nicely left something out that I'm going to add back in. Yes, the fire ventilation research that they did was through a federal grant. The post fire, the out the five days, the instrumentation, the analysis of those samples, was all done by UL, and more importantly paid for significant dollars by UL. And I just cannot say enough good things about the fact that Gavin's boss Dan, Steve Kerber, on up the chain who approved the expenditure of these funds to do this significant work.

So they have opened the barn door, so to speak. There are other projects underway. There is a lot more that needs to be done regarding the health hazards of the post fire environment. We're going to know a lot more five years from now than we know today, but they have taken a huge first step so that we can really drill down and see what these hazards are. And the results of that research going forward will likely change how fire investigations are done. What that's going to look like in 10 years, I don't know. But I think that it will be significantly different in a number of areas than it is today.

Rod Ammon: Thank you. And following along with that theme, Dr. Horn, what's up next for FSRI's post fire environment research agenda?

Dr. Gavin Horn: Well, the next step is to continue looking at these types of structures in various different opportunities that may come available to FSRI. As mentioned earlier, the paper that we published was a result of being able to piggy back on some studies that were conducted at FSRI's campus in Delaware County, Pennsylvania. But there's also going to be opportunities to potentially look at fire scenes that are out there outside of the controlled environments of our research campus. So using some of those same methodologies to go out and monitor some post fire scene investigations that are going out in the world. And we have some opportunities hopefully to do some of those investigations later this year.

We're also interested in expanding some of the measurements that we are taking. Oftentimes it's best to develop a measurement methodology in some of the controlled environments that we can can conduct in Delaware County, or in some of our laboratories at North Brook, Illinois, or in Columbia, Maryland, and then move them out into the world where you'll have more variability in the fuels that are involved in the fire or the ventilation that is involved in the fire or the firefighting tactics. So we're hoping to expand out and to look at some of those additional pieces that we'll be able to find out in actual structure fires that are being responded to throughout the United States, as well as some of the other compounds.

We focused on some of the benzene, toluene, ethylbenzene, xylene and styrene known as BTEXS. We've focused on some aldehydes and other compounds that we didn't find in very high concentrations in our study, but we might find in higher concentrations elsewhere. And furthermore, there's other compounds that we can look for, that we should look for, and are working to understand how to develop that measurement capability. Some compounds such as flame retardants that get released from furnishings as they burn inside a residential structure. PFAS, polyfluoroalkyl substances are also a compound that are of concern to the fire service and the contamination that may result from compounds that are on fire that contain some of those, or I should say some materials that are on fire that contain some of those compounds. And do they get released into the air and contaminate the post-fire scene? So really interested in going broader and deeper in understanding the chemical exposures that post fire investigators might encounter on the fire scene.

Rod Ammon: You go so far and so deep that the one message that I'm getting out of this is: Boy, cover up. Wear the best gear you have because there's things that are out there we know will kill you, and there are things out there we're not even sure about yet.

Dr. Gavin Horn: Absolutely

Rod Ammon: Appreciate your work.

Dr. Gavin Horn: Yeah. Yeah. And what we measured is one of the most complete characterizations of the compounds that are present on the fire ground and the investigation scenes. But again, there's many others there that we don't know yet. We don't know the concentrations there are, and in some cases we don't know the impact on health and safety of the fire service. So you're absolutely right. Understand that the contaminants are there and we need to be diligent to protect ourselves from those contaminants in whatever way we can.

Rod Ammon: Well, we appreciate your curiosity and all the work that you do. Jeff, I want to give you an opportunity to mention something you already touched on, and that is letting the audience know when the third edition of the IAAI Health and Safety Committee Document will be out.

Jeff Pauley: Absolutely we have for the first time, the in three years, thankfully our International Training Conference coming up in a few weeks in Jacksonville. On Wednesday of that week, April 13th, there is an entire block of health and safety sessions. So there are four sessions that day, Dr. Horn and Dr. Madrzykowski will be there along with many other research folks giving some excellent presentations. I'm really excited about that. And in conjunction with that, we will be releasing the third edition of best practices. So April 13 is the key date. For those who cannot attend, we have what I refer to a hot link, iaaiwhitepaper.com, which goes to the research page within the fire arson website. You do not have to be a member of the IAAI to access that information. So the third addition will be there and all of the other resource materials that we have developed in conjunction with the work that we do are there and available for anybody.

There are one-page flyers that can be printed and put up as posters, just all sorts of things. So April 13th is the key date that we are releasing that document and getting together with a bunch of really smart people to talk about fire investigator health and safety research. We have a whole session on behavioral health that Dr. Kelly O'Dare from Florida is doing along with one of our committee members. A lot of good stuff coming up. It's going to be great. I'm really excited. A lot of work's gone into putting that together and bringing it forward for everybody.

Rod Ammon: Looking forward to seeing you out there. We've gone deep today, gentlemen, into the ash. And I wonder if we're missing anything, if there's any message that we need to get out there. Or do you feel like we've pretty much gotten out there what we need to?

Dr. Gavin Horn: I like your relatively straightforward message of: We need to be aware that we are going into a dangerous environment while doing some of these investigations. There's risks there, some that we don't know. So protect yourself as best you can, as high a level of respiratory and dermal protection, as you can provide and you can wear, as high level of monitoring as possible, including formaldehyde. And again, ensuring that our firefighters are prepared. I should say, ensuring that our fire investigators are prepared for the job physically and medically, so that they can be healthy and safe while they're doing these activities. It seems fairly straightforward considering the complexity of what we're facing, but those steps can go a long way to helping reduce some of the risks for our fire investigators.

Rod Ammon: Anything you add Jeff?

Jeff Pauley: Amen to that. No, that really hits the nail on the head. That, and just a cold scene is not a safe scene. Simple, basic. If we can get people to understand that and do all the things that Dr. Horn just referred to, life will be much better.

Rod Ammon: Thank you both. Really grateful for your time today. And this is some real important stuff, and I hope to see both of you out at ITC in Jacksonville.

Jeff Pauley: Looking forward to it.

Dr. Gavin Horn: Thank you. You too.

Jeff Pauley: All right. Thank you, Rod. See you guys soon. Thanks. Bye.

Rod Ammon: Bye.

Dr. Gavin Horn: Bye.

Rod Ammon: Listeners can get the full text of the study we talked about today, as well as the latest edition of the IAAI Health and Safety Committees Fire Investigator Health and Safety Best Practices Document using the links on this podcast page. For more in-depth training on health and safety in the post fire environment, check out the IAAI's 2022 International Training Conference and Expo taking place April 10th through the 15th in Jacksonville, Florida. One full day of conference is devoted to health and safety training, and both Dr. Horn and investigator Pauley will be there presenting, including talking about the FSRI's research, impacting fire investigators.

This podcast and CFITrainer.net are made possible by funding from a Fire Prevention and Safety Grant from the Assistance To Firefighters Grant Program, administered by FEMA and the US Department of Homeland Security. There's also support from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives, and voluntary online donations from CFITrainer.net users and podcast listeners.

Thanks for joining us today on the podcast, stay safe. We'll see you next month for the IAAI and CFITrainer.net. I'm Rod Ammon. This podcast is written by Cathy Dipierro and edited by Karl Erikson. Lynda Aurilio handles scheduling and production management, and Stacey Anderson and Jason Jammer handle promotion and social media.

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October 2021 - Welcome to the CFITrainer.Net Podcast. It's been a while since we've done a news round up so today we're covering some new research and fire investigation cases.
Fire as a Cover for Murders and Gender Reveal Fires: September 2021 - This episode we talk to Texas Ranger Sergeant Drew Pilkington about incendiary fires as a cover for murder and we discuss a tragic quadruple domestic violence homicide.
May 2021 - As part of National Arson Awareness Week, CFITrainer.Net has a new podcast exploring the week's theme, "Arson During Civil Unrest."
December 2020 - On this podcast we talk to Bobby Schaal about the new Fire Investigation for Fire Officer certificate and then we offer a brief update on an investigation in Stowe, Vermont.
August 2020 - This month we talk to a legend in the fire investigation field, Dr. Quintiere, sometimes known as Dr. Q. He has a rich experience in the fire service dating back to the 70’s, and he is working on fire in micro-gravity today.
July 2020 - July '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this new episode of the CFITrainer.Net podcast, Scott Bennett, talks about the fascinating case he and Mark Shockman worked that won them the IAAI Investigator of the Year Award. You won't want to miss our conversation. And, new IAAI President Rick Jones stops by to discuss what he is excited about for IAAI's growth this coming year — there are a lot of innovative and valuable initiatives on the way.
June 2020 - June '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this month's podcast we interview Doug Byron, President and Senior Forensic Chemist from the FAST lab about fats and oils and spontaneous combustion, and how they are involved in fire investigation. After our interview with Doug, we offer some thoughts on your job and the COVID-19 situation.
May 2020 - May '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. Join us this month for a new podcast where we talk briefly about online learning that is available and then we speak with Dr. Peter Mansi, Past President of the IAAI.
April 2020 - April '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month on the Podcast we interview President Barry M. Grimm from the IAAI and talk to Wayne Miller, Author of "Burn Boston Burn -The largest arson case in the history of the country.
March 2020 - March '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month on the Podcast we talk about some resources for COVID, updates from the IAAI and talk with a fire Marshall in New Hampshire about challenges in their region related to Sober Homes.
February 2020 - February '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast follows along with our technology theme. We look at social media’s effect on some fire investigations and then we talk with Mike Parker about his work with social media while at the LA County Sheriff’s Department.
January 2020 - January '20 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast gives you updates on Australia’s wild fires and an investigation and arrest tied to a large New Jersey fire. We also talk with Zach McCune from Rolfe’s Henry about a case study and course that he and Shane Otto will be leading at ITC this year. Zach talks about an arson fraud case and how spoofing and masking technologies were used to frame an innocent mother and perpetuate an arson fraud.
December 2019 - December '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In under ten minutes this podcast offers a review of 2019 milestones and new content and features that you might have missed. We also give you a quick preview of what to expect in 2020.
November 2019 Podcast - November '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we learn about two new technology solutions being studied for fire investigation and then we visit with Lester Rich from the National Fire Academy
October 2019 Podcast - October '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this podcast episode, we’re back for the second part of the CCAI live burn training event — the actual burn and post-fire.
September 2019 Podcast - September '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we travel to San Luis Obispo where we were hosted by the California chapter of the IAAI (CCAI). We had a rare opportunity to experience what it’s like to set up this training and experience a wildland burn in California. There was a lot to learn!
August 2019 Podcast - August '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's CFITrainer.Net podcast is under 15 minutes and offers information about fires in electric vehicles and what you need to know.
May 2019 Podcast - May '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this month's CFITrainer.Net podcast, you'll hear from ATF Special Agent Chad Campanell, who will discuss how ATF can assist state and local fire investigators with training and investigations, ATF resources available to fire investigators, and ATF's support of CFITrainer.Net. Also, we summarize the final report of a multi-fatality fire at a senior living community in Pennsylvania, where ATF cooperated with state and local investigators to reach conclusions.
April 2019 Podcast - April '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. There are two new additions to CFITrainer.Net! A new podcast with Dan Madrzykowski from UL speaking about ventilation and Fire Flow, and a new module called “Fire Flow Analysis”.
March 2019 Podcast - March '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast includes updates from the IAAI related to the election, the upcoming ITC, and a new website specifically about evidence collection. After the updates, you will also hear some news stories related to fire investigation.
February 2019 Podcast - February '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month take 10 mins and hear some fire investigation and IAAI news.
January 2019 Podcast - January '19 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we’re looking back on some of the biggest issues in fire investigation in 2018.
November 2018 Podcast - November '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we talk with Jeff Pauley from the IAAI’s Health and Safety Committee. Jeff is an IAAI-CFI and the Chairman of the Health and Safety Committee. In this podcast, he talks about ways to reduce exposure to carcinogens related to fire investigation. By listening, you will learn about ways to reduce your risks, learn about new resources that are available to assist you, and research that is coming soon.
October 2018 Podcast - October '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month meet and learn about IAAI’s new Executive Director, Scott Stephens and plans for the future. After that interview, hear some wild stories from the national news related to fire investigation.
September 2018 News Roundup - September '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts.
Short stories related to fire investigation - June '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. Join us for a brief Podcast that includes five minutes of short stories related to fire investigation.
What you need to know about Arson Awareness week - April '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we welcome Tonya Hoover, the Superintendent of the National Fire Academy. Superintendent Hoover came to the NFA with more than 20 years of experience in local and state government, most recently as the California State Fire Marshal.
Growing pot and earning Bitcoin can start fires? - March '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this month’s podcast, hear a story about how the Bitcoin business might be causing fires? What similarities are there between Pot growers and now Bitcoin miners?
Training related to wildland fire investigation - February '18 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast highlights new training related to wildland fire investigation featuring an interview with Paul Way, and this year’s International Training Conference. We also have a pretty wild story before we wrap up. Birds starting fires?
Smart homes and digital data gathering issues - December '17 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this podcast, we discuss two topics on the technology and forensics cutting edge. Michael Custer of Kilgore Engineering, Inc. and retired Special Agent Tully Kessler share some knowledge and give us a taste of the classes that they will be presenting at ITC 2018.
Discussion with Writer Monica Hesse - September '17 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this podcast, you will hear some great news related to the IAAI and CFITrainer.Net and then we have an interview with Monica Hesse, the writer of a new book called "American Fire: Love, Arson, and Life in a Vanishing Land."
Discussion with Criminalist- John DeHaan - June '17 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month on the CFITrainer.Net podcast, we talk to Criminalist, fire investigation expert and Author of "Kirk’s Fire Investigation", John DeHaan.
The Ghost Ship - May '17 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. For this podcast, we hear from a retired Captain of the Long Beach Fire Department, Pat Wills. Pat has been in the fire service for 37 years. He has been a leader and an investigator, now he is an educator speaking around the country about the importance of code enforcement.
Fast Podcast about ITC! - March '17 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we talk to David Bridges about what to expect at ITC and the training you won’t want to miss.
CFITrainer Podcast- A profile with an IAAI-CFI® - February '17 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. Join us this month for our podcast as we interview IAAI member and CFI, Jeff Spaulding from Middletown, Ohio. Jeff talks about his work in both the public and private sector and then he shares an interesting story about how a pacemaker is helping in an investigation.
An interview with Dr. James Quintiere - December '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In a discussion with Dr. James Quintiere, we learn about some of his work in fire sciences, a bit about his research, his opinions related to the World Trade Center investigation and what he thinks is important to fire investigation as a scholarly leader in our field.
Fire Investigation After the Flood Podcast - November '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we talk to Dan Hebert, an IAAI, CFI about "How Floods affect Fire Investigation."
September 2016 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - September '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we talk about the recent changes in the FAA's regulations for commercial and public sector use of UAS or "Drones".
August 2016 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - August '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we talk to Jessica Gotthold about the Seaside Heights fire in NJ from 2013
July 2016 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - July '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we talk to Fire Marshall, Ken Helms of the Enid, OK. Fire Department about his team winning the Fire Investigator of the Year award.
March 2016 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - March '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's fire investigation podcast from the IAAI's CFITrainer.Net focuses on the Youth Firesetting Information Repository and Evaluation System, which is called YFIRES for short.
February 2016 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - February '16 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's fire investigation podcast from the IAAI's CFITrainer.Net focuses on what you need to do to ensure the integrity of samples sent to the lab. A conversation with Laurel Mason of Analytical Forensic Associates.
September 2015 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - September '15 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. Our podcast related to the legalization of recreational marijuana and its effect on fire investigation was one of the most popular podcasts ever on CFITrainer.Net. This month’s podcast is a follow up with one of our listeners from California who is an investigator doing training on this very topic.
August 2015 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - August '15 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast is about NFIRS where we interview the Executive Director of The National Association of State Fire Marshals Fire Research and Education Foundation, Jim Narva.
July 2015 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - July '15 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. In this special edition of podcast we’re going to meet the newest IAAI Investigator of the Year, Andrea Buchanan.
May 2015 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - May '15 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's Arson Investigator podcast from IAAI & CFITrainer interviews Jason McPherson from MSD Engineering to talk about some of these new technology tools.
April 2015 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - April '15 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's Arson Investigator podcast from IAAI & CFITrainer interviews Dave Perry, a lawyer in Colorado discussing what fire chiefs, fire investigators, and the legal system are seeing in a state with legalized cannabis in regard to fire cause involving marijuana.
February 2015 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - Feb '15 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's Arson Investigator podcast from IAAI & CFITrainer interviews Mike Schlatman and Steve Carman who are both successful fire investigators and now business owners who have transitioned from the public to the private sector.
December 2014 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - December '14 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast interviews Steve Avato from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives explaining the process of elimination and how it is a critical part of the scientific method.
June 2014 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - June '14 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast interviews the 2014 Investigator of the Year.
April 2014 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - April '14 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast interviews with Don Robinson, Special Agent in Charge with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. Currently stationed at the National Center for Explosives Training and Research, located at the Redstone Arsenal in Huntsville, Alabama.
January 2014 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - January '14 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast takes a look inside the process of revising NFPA 921 and NFPA 1033.
October 2013 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - October '13 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast focuses on the fire research work of Underwriters’ Laboratories, better known as UL.
February 2013 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - February '13 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month we have an interview with George Codding who returned from a recent trip to Saipan and gives us a closer look at the international activities of the International Association of Arson Investigators
Mid Year 2012 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - Mid Year '12 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This podcast features a mid-year update on the IAAI’s new initiatives and ways for you to get more involved with the organization.
September 2012 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - September '12 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features an in-depth look at the recent live-burn fire experiments exercise conducted on Governor’s Island, New York by the New York City Fire Department, the National Institute of Standards and Technology, Underwriters Laboratory, and the Trust for Governor’s Island.
August 2012 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - August '12 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This is a special edition of the CFITrainer.Net podcast previewing the ITC 2013. There’s a new name for the Annual Training Conference from the IAAI now called the International Training conference.
April 2012 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - April '12 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features an interview with Chief Ernest Mitchell, Jr., the US Fire Administrator. Also we will discuss the upcoming ATC, Annual Training Conference, from the IAAI about to happen in Dover, Delaware.
March 2012 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - March '12 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features an interview with ATF Special Agent Billy Malagassi out of the Tulsa, OK Field Office about investigating fires in clandestine drug labs. We also report on NIST’s findings in the Charleston Sofa Super Store fire and IAAI’s Evidence Collection Practicum.
December 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - December '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features one of the presenters from this year’s IAAI ATC and see how a single photo broke the Provo Tabernacle fire case.
October 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - October '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features an interview with Deborah Nietch, the new Executive Director of IAAI.
July 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - July '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features an interview with Tom Fee discussing details of investigating wildland fires.
June 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - June '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month's podcast features a lot of exciting things that are happening at CFITrainer.Net
May 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - May '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month highlights the IAAI ATC in Las Vegas and the third installment in the "It Could Happen to You" series.
ATC 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - This podcast discusses the upcoming IAAI Annual Training Conference and National Arson Awareness Week.
April 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - April '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This podcast announces the release of the program, The First Responder’s Role in Fire Investigation, which teaches first responders how to make critical observations and take important scene preservation actions at a fire scene.
March 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - March '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features some of the instructors from the upcoming 2011 Annual Training Conference, to provide a preview of the courses they will be presenting.
February 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - February '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features an update on fire grants and an interview with Steve Austin
January 2011 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - January '11 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features the release of the new edition of Fire Investigator: Principles and Practice to NFPA 921 and 1033, new flammability requirements from UL for pre-lit artificial Christmas trees and a growing fire problem in Dubai with factories turned into worker dormitories.
December 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - December '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast focuses on home candle fires, lightning punctures in gas piping, and respiratory diseases in the fire services.
November 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - November '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features research findings for structural stability in engineered lumber by UL, the ban on antifreeze in residential sprinkler systems, and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration’s investigation of Jeep Grand Cherokee fuel tanks.
October 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - October '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features high-profile fire cases, why people leave stovetop cooking unattended and how new sensors under development may improve fire research.
September 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - September '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features how to use the ATF’s Bomb Arson Tracking System, IAAI Foundation grants, electrical fires and indoor marijuana cultivation.
August 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - August '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast focuses on social media as a fire investigation tool, a potential problem with modular home glued ceilings and research from Underwriters Laboratories on the effects of ventilation on structure fires.
July 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - July '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast is a roundtable on some of the latest research and technical activities that impact fire investigation, featuring Daniel Madrzykowski (moderator), Steven Kerber, and Dr. Fred Mowrer.
June 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - June '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast discusses career advancement, budget cuts and their impact on fire investigation, and the 2010-2016 ATF Strategic Plan.
ATC 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - Follow-up and Interviews from Orlando. Learn about the conference, hear what attendees had to say.
May 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - May '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. The second in our safety series called "It Could Happen To You." Our Long-Term Exposure roundtable is moderated by Robert Schaal.
April 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - April '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. The first of our two-part safety series called "It Could Happen To You." Our roundtable is moderated by Robert Schaal.
March 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - March '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features a conversation about legislative affairs affecting the fire service with Bill Webb, Executive Director of the Congressional Fire Services Research Institute.
February 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - February '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features our interview with a commercial kitchen’s fire expert about what you need to know when you work a commercial kitchen fire.
January 2010 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - January '10 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features a look at preliminary research on corrosion caused by Chinese drywall, a new database focused on fires in historic buildings, a warning on blown-in insulation, and the launch of the new firearson.com web site.
December 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - December '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features cooking fires, highlights of the International Code Council’s Annual Meeting on code requirements, including requiring residential sprinkler systems, and an easy way to keep up with recalls from the US Consumer Product Safety Commission.
November 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - November '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features chimney fires, including recent news on surgical flash fires, a proposed national arsonist registry, lightning research and an innovation in personal protective equipment.
October 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - October '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast is devoted to Fire Prevention Week.
September 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - September '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features the relationship between climate conditions and fire risk, new research on formulating fireproof walls and the latest in IAAI news.
August 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - August '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month takes a look at the dangerous combination of summer heat and oily rags, the rise in vacant home fires, and preview research underway on Australia’s devastating "Black Saturday" brush fires.
July 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - July '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month features a look at outdoor grill fires, a fatal fire at a homeless camp in Southern NJ, new NIST research on human behavior during building fires, and IAAI news.
June 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - June '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features live reports from the 2009 IAAI Annual Training Conference held in May.
May 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - May '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This podcast is dedicated to National Arson Awareness Week.
April 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - April '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features the NFPA 921 chapter on marine fire investigations and the myth and reality of static electricity as a source of ignition.
March 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - March '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month focuses on the rise of the hybrid vehicle and what its unique engineering means for the investigation of vehicle fires, the rash of devastating arson fires in Coatesville, Pennsylvania from December 2008 to February 2009, and news from IAAI.
January 2009 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - January '09 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast focuses on the deepening financial crisis in the US and arson for profit fires, how going green may pose a fire hazard and see how rope lighting may be a source of ignition, and IAAI’s Expert Witness Courtroom Testimony course.
December 2008 CFITrainer.Net Podcast - December '08 IAAI & CFITrainer Fire Investigator Podcasts. This month’s podcast features Christmas tree fires, changes to critical fire investigation publications, the weak economy’s impact on home fires, wind’s effect on structure fires, and ATC 2009.